This is Hacker Public Radio Episode 3,804 for Thursday the second of March 2023.
Today's show is entitled, 2022, 2022, 23 new years show Episode 2.
It is part of the series HP or New Year's show.
It is hosted by HP or volunteers and is about 87 minutes long.
It carries an explicit flag.
The summary is 2022, 2023, new years show where people come together and chat.
So what's everybody's big plans for the next game?
What's everybody's big plans for tonight?
I work on champagne bottle with somebody, I'll be a little scared and I'll be a little
scared and I'll be a little more watched, I guess I'll watch the love and five works
just play.
Because I found this the first time it's one for three years because it was all bad
and all kinds of recovery, yeah.
I'm a tree hug and hippie from the yard, but I've lived in the south since the 90s,
but here in Florida, our governor doesn't think there's COVID, nor should we get vaccinated
or wear masks.
I do.
All of everything he tells me to not to do, I do, so I wear masks, I got five vaccinations,
you know?
Right, well, yeah, right, well, in that case, okay, that was a great guy in my log in
that in over here, everything's done right.
I met him in 2013, once at the pub, there are the old pub where you go to because he
was visited from America, where his wife, for his two daughters, she was like 11 and
over at the time, I think, and then he went back to Florida because he moved in with his
American wife, yeah, and then the pandemic, we started having these virtual and on
get-seed luck meetings and it was a mailing list, obviously, but he came in from Florida
and it was really nice and it was like, oh, great, he's on and we could talk to him
that early in the, he stayed late and there were those guys, you knew all kinds of things
he could then from, about all sorts of things, tech-wise and so on, really nice guy, seeing
there with the cabins going in the Florida down, there's kind of a new cat and everything
thought to his wife occasionally because of how helpful it was done, but then he disappeared
last summer, it was not last summer, the summer before it must have been actually, and
my friend and me, if it were from the lug, good friend of mine 10 years now, well,
he went, where he got him, why is he not on the meeting, that's odd, he just
built it, it's the summer, and then he got to October and his wife sent us a message
by the lug contact squad, she could again just computer, he was doing some really good
tech job, no, his wife is locked there with his computer, and it turns out that yes,
he had died on my birthday as well, it sounded like that, that he first died of the COVID
Delta variant in Florida, and it was only 47 years old as well, so yeah, there you go,
he just blocked the virus, he wants you to just hack space and things, but it's just
just so suddenly enough to do it as behind as well, so it's just awful.
Yeah, sorry about that, yeah, I've lost, I've lost two good friends, I lost my mom, my
uncle, I mean, and most of the people I hang out with here just don't mask, they don't
care, you know, I don't, I gave up kind of caring about what they care about, so I don't
mask when I'm having coffee around them, because at least I'm vaccinated, I wear masks
and other public places, but still.
Yeah, I've had five, but I didn't look after Santa's one, because there's some still
so research, we know I didn't have something on the other side, but I don't have five
fibres, but now the Chinese bulls as I open as well to letting people go there and also
go out, and I was reading that they're going to at least in the UK say, so even after
you're coming in from China, you have to be having negative test recovery, I think
America is doing the same policy in Italy or somewhere as well.
Yeah, we're doing that here too, I've noticed that, but yeah, I just happened to live
in one of those, you know, states, 90% of the people seem to not care.
I think so, yeah, I got my impression as well, that Florida was more like, our cinemas
were closing lockdown, and so that was like, no, yeah, you can go and watch cinemas,
my square face mask, but no problem, yeah, yeah, we had, I mean, I used down, we had
the face mask thing as well, but it was like, you can listen my way to big lockdown
like that. Well, the mayor here is not too bad, and for the longest time, all the buses
record you to wear a mask in the uptown trains and stuff, but they slowly but surely get away
with that, because they start losing funding, the governor says, well, if you, if you're
masking to do this stuff, I'm not giving you money. Well, well, interesting one of my good
friends is a nurse who probably 50 years experience maybe more, and he said, the masking
stuff is a limited utility, and again, these vaccinations also have been, they're not,
not as they adapted the regulations to let vaccinations which are less than 100% effective,
go through as vaccines. So COVID vaccines are not like the vaccines for flu or other things,
they were used to traditionally, they have jiggered the definition.
I mean, I personally like that, that yes, the vaccines were possibly a little bit
experimental really, but on the other hand, I assume that they have must,
well, I mean, you're still catching it normally, even they've had this vaccine, but I assume
they've also helped people not become ads on well with COVID when they, when they quit,
so I don't wish at the point as well. Yeah, pretty much only wear masks because I don't want
to get other people sick, and I may be getting sick, I volunteer in shelters and stuff too,
so who knows what I might have. Also, there has been some questions about some of the vaccines
and cardiac problems. Oh, oh, yes, so there was a story about how if you take the Pfizer
jab and your male, and I think there's the story was actually US soldiers or something at first,
and they took the jab and they ended up getting the heart inflamed and started yield something,
and then I'm, but it was interesting, though, when I got all those jab from my third time,
if it was, I said to the male nurse actually, he's also saying, oh, yeah, if you get that,
it'll be temporary, it'll go. And then also the next time I went and did one,
they told me it's straight away, like, yes, you might have this heart thing, but it's very bad,
it'll disappear, and it's nothing to worry about. So, I didn't have had five of them still here.
Yeah, I've had for the modernism, so I've had five of them, yeah. Well, just a lot of the real
problem that you had was even Dr. Fauci, the head of all COVID-19 knowledge,
has admitted that he's told the public what he believes that they can accept. So, he was saying,
early on, that we'll leave back to normal, quickly, you don't need this, you don't need that,
you're whatever, and then he was into everybody, he's got to lock down and it turned out
to get a lot of that stuff was not true.
Matt, Matt, Matt, Matt, did you get vaccinated? I've got vaccinated and one or two boosters,
I have it lifted my car. I've passed, and he's one of those who've raised
of these care is vaccine, then. Right, but the problem you have is that the COVID vaccine
is, well, it was COVID is the first time that your choice of vaccination
has had a serious enforcement, if you. Well, well, well, it was not as they looked
out in the way they have to do it, because especially, I'm going to take, I want to
take England as a good example, I'm an England right, and England is a place where
a lot of people, first of all, the public don't have to go out to a pub is very much
ingrained into society, you go out and have a drink with people sometimes, or ideally,
that's what people do for pub, and then there's night club to a bit as well,
more for younger ones, but, you know, and people really like to do that, they want to
go out to restaurants, or they're going to pub, they will have food and drinks,
and they will have fun, and they will send them out of the things that's
different, and they actually, I mean, they did do it, they did make it, and Boris Johnson, who
was the prime minister at the time, just before they went to lockdown properly, he basically said,
they basically said, look, you can go to a pub at the moment, however, you're not really
supposed to be an idede, or try not to go, because there's this COVID thing going around,
and the other things they can do, and that sort of makes message, so certain people were like,
hey, I'm going to pub anyway, I don't care, others were like, oh, my precious stay at home,
and they had to enforce it with a lockdown really, because otherwise, I mean, people were breaking
lockdown anyway, they had to put a lot of 75 people friends over and things were the households
that you're getting that big no-know, but people are doing it, or maybe how to go
friend or something, and a different household, and we're going to see them, or you know,
people find their own way to break it and justify it, so a tap closed all the fun stuff down,
by by pub, by by cinema, by by restaurant, and this annoyed me as well, because I'm in a place
where, but just outside the real city, I mean, it's quite built up around here, there's the
busy road, but I have good pubs and things down there, and I've got things around here,
and now what they did as well, here in the England, as they, they trolling, as they tried to
tear system, where it would be done on the county that that a place is in, so, because it's
the city was in a different county, technically, always to be the same place back in 1990,
that built up that mail, they ended up in tier two, where it's more relaxed, we ended up in tier
three, where pubs have to be closed, and they could have their pubs open, and then also with
it up Northern England, they put them in tier four, where basing Christmas was pretty much
cancelled as well, and of course those people complain, and so, hey London, you've got the people
coming in London, why don't you put, well, you went to London and will you maybe make a point
or because the case is where, how are you, or better both, they did then stick London and surrounding
areas of London to tear four as well, so they had the most bushes basically, a tear four
was locked down, basically, but they had to close some of this, or people would just be out
as normal doing things, but it was like, you cannot go across the other tier, so this is a
central for workers or medical reason, and then it's got them, it was even more lockdown,
because UK is spitting to four countries really, Scotland was even more lockdown, they had
that more stricter rules, Wales had quite strict rules as well, and Northern Ireland that
took reasonably strict rules, England was actually the most relaxed out of the lot, but we still
have about sort of four sort of closed things down, otherwise people would be out socialising
as normal, I think in India, no, apparently in the Caribbean they banned the alcohol as well,
that's what somebody told me, well it was locked down, it wasn't, they banned the social
drink, they banned the alcohol as well, whilst there's a lockdown, and in India it was like,
why you're out here, why you're out here, get go home, waking the lockdown, I swear I heard as
well, one of the things that I saw in New York City, you couldn't go into the bars, restaurants,
what have you, but they built these little checks and bubbles and whatnot out on the sidewalk,
and people were served outdoors in these temporary buildings or pictures or what have you.
Yeah, yeah, we had similar, when it eased down a bit, I mean the pubs had to be closed and they
were really fussing, they lost a lot of money, etc, but when it eased down a bit, the pubs were
like, it was like, okay, you can use a pub, however, you're not allowed to sit inside,
so if you wanted to buy a beer and how to go inside, all you wanted to go and use the top,
well as that as well, even the toilet was like, you know the toilet, but only one person's supposed to be in
that one, but on top of that, to go around the face mask inside, so it was like really, and then
then they didn't allow to sit outside, and they made some temporary outside sitting places in the
car park and things like that as well, and some were its going now and so much to stay, probably really,
but there was a whole mess, but then when they opened up inside, it was like, you can sit inside,
however, when you move up, but even then, I think he used to have the sanitized when you come into
you, but if you need to move around, buy a beer or go to toilet, you have to put a face mask on,
but then when you come and sit back down at your table, you can take your face mask off,
and then probably, well, I'm just saying that the regulation in a lot of places, a lot of holes in them,
and if they were following the silence, well, I saw a school band was playing,
but those with wind instruments had holes in their mouth so that they could blow through the
window, there comes a point where, well, how are they bad in my church? I mean, yeah, yeah, even churches
have to close here for a bit, and then another thing about like, and then choirs were like the
table, they know it was like, oh man, if you go to sing in a choir, you're going to possibly spread
the choir bed, so no choir's loud and all that as well, and obviously they came like zoom
choir, and they try to mute the combine and work so well, but like really now the churches are closing
as well, not the kind of church. Well, greetings again to Australia and Melbourne, Sydney, etc.
And what made it interesting? Well, when the course the politicians themselves broke the rules
or bad rules, yeah, because we had, there was some of the health minister in Scotland
and you did some made-up resign slightly and then named them, we had the whole party thing
and the other guy, the guy went somewhere and so on. I didn't remember the America, but I
assumed there was stuff going on over there as well. Oh yeah, there was, there was a lot of
liberal parties and liberal fundraisers and whatnot, nobody mask up for those and the general
consensus about the rules in America were that the people who wrote the rules were fine with
the rules as long as they didn't have to obey them. So for they said here as well, when things
started to happen, yeah, just like, well, they may make the rules, they can break rules and
where's the full rules, but they can bend and break rules. Well, a shout out to Morton See
there, are you around? I think he was driving part of the time so he can't really manipulate
the system. Speaking of making the rules, I'm going to suggest next year that they at least
put eastern time equivalents on the times zone so that the poor American can have some
fighting chance of actually getting the time trip. Yeah, don't be fair, I can agree.
And by the American, I buy the current rewagee because the amount of Americans are on this
they come on this day, yeah, it just isn't, and the Canadians, you know, well, not many days
I don't think, but yeah, it makes sense. Well, the thing about it is we were talking about how
the rules are enforced. How do we just greet someone? Well, why haven't some country just went
into New Year, yeah? Australia's gotten greeted a couple of times. Happy New Year, Australia.
Australia isn't like full kind of thing as well, but I'm just saying, I know, and I was trying
to follow the notes, but it's very hard to follow the notes when you have no translation to your
local time. Well, you're trying to justify that, wasn't that? You know, UTC, but then you have to
work out the other times. Right, I mean, give us time that's useful, or maybe I should just give
up on doing the usual breeding thing. No, yeah, very on. It means you might get wrong some
web, it's a bit. I think it's good to have wings. Yeah, well, I'd been looking forward to this all
year, and this is painful. The show was due to greetings. I've been looking forward to the show,
and I was going to try to do my best on my breeding, but without proper support, it's very hard.
Yeah, I've just looked at what the show is. Well, every just a little bit early, though,
I assume that we load more people on here later. Okay, COVID was 2020 free. It's going to be like the
fifth normal year in some ways. After 2019, I'd like to say how the conference is all on and things
high-fix-hows, and yeah. Well, the interesting, the thing that's most interesting to me
is that even discussing whether COVID is in America, discussing whether COVID measures were effective
or what not. There are a lot of, like, YouTube, you can't discuss it. I'm doing it here as well,
I think it was like a, it was a investigation or whatever, you know, looking into COVID,
and it's a bit of a big one all, and it is effective and all that kind of stuff.
Well, also we found out that the narrative we were getting from our government people was adjusted
to the science, well, an interesting data, and I found, I can't really source it, but a lot of the
CDC people were getting residuals from their work on COVID. Do you know what?
They were getting residuals from their work on the COVID vaccine problem.
Were you money? Well, I mean, money. Now, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I see
they've heard that some of them actually got money just from, I don't know as well, quite a bad
money. Then we had a formal help. If they were getting paid to tell you, by the vaccine
companies, would they push a semi-tested vaccine quite so hard? I don't mind, but we had
a formal self, exactly, yeah, who had something went wrong with the internet to kind of like,
we said it's an MP, but you quit as health secretary. You know, you'd be only getting on a
climate slope, you'd get me out of here, get a game-show thing, but a few stunts kind of and
trying to help you redeem yourself a little bit as well. But they also had very
people asking questions in the world, but you know it's difficult, when people couldn't
visit care homes or they were like, no, sorry, you've got miles dying or whatever, but you
can't go visit there because it's COVID or you're all late for what you can with face-fast
maybe, but that's what got a lot of people when they were told they can't even visit
their dying family or whatever and yet the MP's going to break the rules like that. That's
the stuff that really got people. Well, in New York State, the governor had them put
known COVID patients into the nursing home. Yes, we, the older people are at high risk.
Well, let's make certain that they're exposed, they also get a high exposure. If the average
guy made that kind of suggestion, he would be considered criminal.
I think we had to make similar here, or something like that. Well, I'm looking forward to an interest
in 2023. Yes, so my, with, like I was saying, with conferences back on high-fi shows and
things, the beds, you know, it's going to be like 20, it's going to be like 20, it's going to be
more than 20, 19, I think. Listen, with some changes here in that, but, you know, it's not sucked
either. Yeah, I think. Well, what's going to be interesting with everything that's coming out
of Twitter, we're going to find out if our government actually works. We're going to find out
if our government actually works. Well, there's a lot of Twitter files are saying that the
government, just the support of what not, was manipulating the 2020 election, and anyone is also
was suppressing conservative use on Twitter. Yes, that's not a government name. Well,
I apparently, with the British government, the Russians had influence in a bit, or something
with elections. Well, we're not on many platforms, we're not allowed to question whether
there was some interference, even though there seems to be evidence. Yeah, and the kind of
parent made a European commission take some money, or let me have them with them, a quartet off, so that's a little bit
corrupt as well. So I'd be just like to be in the actual recent film online on the Daily Mail
and whatever new websites. Oh, yes, some of those European commission regulations that would have
required people to get a license for every crossposting on the internet. I think that by
and that would definitely all the government's probably least a little bit corrupt, or whatever,
but that's how it is. Yeah, I have a book that was, it was an end. I have a book about the internet
that was very interesting. This guy in America helps convert a lot of organizations for international
standards of documents into PDF4 and in turn they allowed him to put this information up on a
server in America for international access. Yeah, but what was interesting is that if you wanted
to get these UN documents from the source in Geneva, you had to pay an arm like up to the net
because the documents were funding, were a slush fund for ISO. Also, because of the high prices,
every year they would print a ton of these standards documents, and they would sell very few of them,
but the fact that they were being printed by the UN meant that the printers were making up quite
a bit, even if nobody was buying the document. Right, so I'll tell you now, my battery is getting
down here. On May 7th, and I'll always take a laptop, write it to about 5th, or something, it'll go,
come back on their later. So I've actually got around maybe 5th, 10 minutes left before that, so yeah,
what it keeps me out later, that's why. Well, it's been a pleasure talking to you and having somebody
to talk with, I mean, take a break here. But I said about 5th, 10 minutes, I think they're like,
yeah, so that's fine. But I can make pretty much kill on my old privilege to turn itself off with it,
fine. And I can chat with you, charge it, and save it as well, but it's different. Can pay them
with cool things, though, or yeah. Maybe he just too busy with his kids or something,
he's not even even even there. Oh, they'll keep recording. I'm trying to make him play the phone,
you may really, I bet this will be get quite busy in next, maybe next 3-4 hours or something.
Well, I hope so. So I'm looking forward to this all, what a voyage as well, I'll go for
wow, yeah. Well, I've got about 7 minutes to my next greeting, though. I think around that, I'm
going to probably get kicked off as in my actual diet, and that's that, but that's fine.
Yeah, well, I'm going to do the next greeting, and then that's about to, then I'm going to have
to take a break. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's just grabbed my food, and I'm here for the
next little while. Speaking of food, well, that just means you're under proper fee line super
bigger than I need to make. Thank you. This, this finger in the dark job is, there's not what it's got out to be.
Happy New Year to small reason about Australia, Adelaide, Broken Hill,
hello, Joe. Hey, what's going on? Time. I'm just having a bite. Yeah, we had one here for about
20 years. It was our first cat combined on the house, because in the suburbs here,
we have a coyote prop. Yeah, mine's, it was my, my wife's, can't she passed it? So I just, well, I'm sorry
to hear you a lot. Yeah, it's been used to living alone, doing what, yeah, I wanted to have an old
Google plug, what we made. Yeah, I'm an older gentleman. My brother's a long haul trucker who doesn't
come, he's still Pennsylvania. I got you. I'll probably be. Got a second time to being a third
date. You know, Joe, Jay, would help if you didn't keep putting teddy bears in people's beds.
That's creeping them out. Now, now, now, now, now, now. It's for us. It's not the right in here.
I do that. I got to make more contact, probably. I can terminate you.
Oh, welcome. It's for us to our boat on my outpost to either.
That's nice to meet you. I just came in here because I saw George pimping it out on a telegram group.
May I ask, go, what your tech interests might be? Yeah, sure. So I'm a technical writer.
That's my day job. I'm also a software maintainer for a Fediver's project called Funquail.
I am sort of Linux enthusiasts, 3bSD enthusiast, X3bSD port maintainer,
stop doing that because I hate packaging software, hate it, hate it, hate it, hate it.
So before that, I was a Windows system administrator in a college.
So kind of all over the place, really. Well, sounds familiar. What is your product?
Funquail is a federated music streaming platform. Basically, it's a tool you can use.
You can upload your music to it to stream on different devices, but you can also publish your music in
the things called channels, which allows you to share it like a mastered on feed or a pixel fed feed.
And it uses that activity pub to interact with the sort of wider Fediverated web.
So that's where I heard it. I'm just one of the members of the Linux blog characters.
Yeah, since value people in the, I don't know you didn't do enough.
For a few years now, I was with some of the other dev random, and some of the others,
back in the day that are polluted and the survivors have set up the Linux blog ads.
And my interactions with the Linux started back in the 80s. I had an account on the machine
that the MIT that the students had scraped together and was on an early version of ethernet called chaos,
that which by the way has been recreated for emulated systems now.
Yes, I have some interested in the older systems.
Yeah, that stuff is fascinating to be honest.
Especially to see where it all started and how we took it from there, really.
Well, you want some truly interesting reading.
And in Lin Wheeler at recite called garlic.com, I think,
have a lot of posts about IBM from the early days, 360, 370 days are enough.
Did you say garlic.com?
Yes, they have a lot of posting.
And one of the things that's fascinating is that IBM worldwide network was
not built by IBM management.
It was built by system administrators,
talking systems together like the old UUCP because they needed communications.
And it became a company network because the technician who knew how to hook things together did the hook ups.
And then later on, management was able to use it as as a business tool.
Also, a lot of it was running on the most despised operating system that IBM produced,
which is VM 370.
That was despised by IBM internally.
Right. Why?
Because it wasn't MVS.
Ah, accents.
It's not the same I like.
However, MVS could not do anything except via no end node.
They couldn't handle the work that VM was doing, including supporting MVS.
That's what kept VM 370 a lot.
It was the fact that it was used to largely support MVS.
The IBM's bitnet network was also bigger than the internet for many years
because of IBM's worldwide region.
Yeah, market dominance, yeah.
Well, not so much market.
Well, yes, but just IBM had more offices than U.S. had imaging.
So, you know, something had to look at them up.
Also, they had about cornered the market on data-wide encryption systems because, of course,
IBM wanted to secure its data going across country boundaries in life.
Yeah.
Yep.
I'm just a notice of fine because I went to garlic.com.
And it's a very bizarre site.
Like it's obviously for some sort of company.
You have to actually go to garlic.com slash-tilled-lin.
You actually get to the interesting posts.
But they don't link any or on their main sites, weird.
Well, it is a resource for a certain group of people.
Just like the computer folklore use there.
Yes.
I was actually, I've been reading folklore.org, which is all about the original by the early days
of Apple and the sort of making of the original Lisa and Macintosh.
Somebody's put the entire site up on Gemini, and they've done a mirror of it, and they form
added it for Gemini, so I've been idling away reading that in my spare time just to kind of
read up on it because it's fascinating stuff, like just looking at these people talking about
all the stuff they had to do to try and squeeze an entire system onto such a small set of resources
and how they had to steal so much resource from other things.
That sort of thing always fascinated me. I remember watching a, it was like a short documentary
about the making of Crash Bandicoot on the PlayStation 1, the original PlayStation 1,
and about how when creating that they had to, the developers wanted Crash to himself
to have quite a large polygon count, even though the rest of the game had quite limited polygons.
And to do that, they had to find more memory because obviously the system memory was very limited.
So the developers went around looking at all of the different places in the system that had
memory, and then started taking the memory allocation away from different parts of the system to
see if it broke it. And if it didn't break it, they added it to the Crash Bandicoot model,
as a memory resource. So it just like they just stole a bunch of system memory that was
supposed to be allocated elsewhere, and they didn't really know what the actual repercussions
of that would be because Sony never really documented it, but it worked, you know, the game played.
So yeah, well, so much of the split and win-wheeler story is he started out in the early days of
the first virtual memory 360s. And in fact, the application environment used by VM-370,
wherever user had basically had its own little VM machine or has own little desktop slice of
the machine, get originally started out running on the 360 hardware,
and only later did they make it so that it would only run on a virtualized,
you would have to have an underlying hypervisor. Yeah. Also, one of the early uses of VM-370 was to cover
up the appalling memory problems that MVT and the early massive 360 and 360, and 360,
with the operating traditional operating system pad for memory links and whatnot. With a VM system,
they could cover up a lot of holes that would show through if you were running it strictly
on the resources of the actual hardware. So VM-370 was to cover the memory links and the memory
and efficiency of IBM's other operating system. It's so interesting to me because
you know, working in web development, you don't really think all that much about
resources. Computers are so powerful nowadays and with the web, it's not even a real consideration,
and it should be a many should be. This is not the right thing or anything, but you do just sort of
end up creating ungodly large apps because, hey, we don't need to worry about,
you know, memory allocation, the browser takes care of all that for us. And it's no wonder
computers are in the state they're in today. I came back. I come from CPM and DOS,
and stuff like that. I was beating DOS around the head and shoulders to run applications that
really shouldn't, like free Pascal, which is the core of the Lazarus project, which basically
is open source Delphi. But I was running that on a DOS machine using a long file name,
driver, and all kinds of beating the heck out of a little preset.
Yeah, I've looked at Gemini, but I've had so many other things to deal with, and I haven't
been able to explore the Gemini capsule unit. Yeah, it's kind of exploded onto the scene a
few years ago, didn't it? And it was, I actually made a post on MasterDom because we have the
recent boom of Twitter users coming to the Fediverse. And one of the big problems I saw was that
you had a lot of people who were Fediverse, you know, users had been for a long time,
basically posting a lot about, you know, how great the Fediverse is, and that was all they posted
about. Like, people were coming in from Twitter, and these people were just telling the
no, the Fediverse is great, which is fine. But this was the problem we had with Gemini. Was that Gemini
was a really interesting, cool, little project. It was very, very easy to set up and get working
with and all that. And, you know, it fulfills a niche. Like, it's great on this rubbish old
thinkpad I've got here because I just use a nice text browser and everything worked perfectly,
because it doesn't have JavaScript or anything like that messing with it. The problem was,
and the reason I left Gemini initially, was every single, like, gem blog I could find, every single
capsule, was just people posting about how great Gemini is. And that just becomes very boring
after a while. So I came back to a few years later, like, when this Twitter boom happened,
because I, because I was reminded of it and I went back to it and it does look like things have
started to get a little bit more settled and interesting there now. Like, there are some
really cool projects that actually use Gemini's advantages and strengths, specifically with things
like tofu, TLS certificates. So there's a micro blogging site on there called station,
which is like a essentially a masterdom for Gemini. There's a really cool thing called
Astrobotony, which allows you to raise a plant by, you know, basically going in, watering it every
day, for giving you fertilizer, stuff like that. It's got some cool little projects on it.
There are some decent blogs and nice web apps that do some interesting web apps and nice,
like, uploads that do some interesting stuff. But yeah, I was just initially put off of it,
because the entire thing is just a big sort of array for Gemini, aren't we? The best thing ever.
And I was like, this gets very boring after a while. Every single gem blog I've read has just been
about how Gemini's better than go for and the web. So I was worried for a little bit that
Masterdom was turning into that. I was worried that it was going to become another thing where
a bunch of people joined Masterdom coming from Twitter and they saw that Masterdom was just a
bunch of people talking about how Masterdom looks great. But thankfully, it's very quickly
you know, found it stride. By the way, do you know what kill would go for? I didn't know
go for what was dead. Is it dead? I mean, that's still some good news for some time.
Fire, fire, fire. No, go for, hey, not all that. You've got some to say, speak up. We're, we're,
we've got two ears, one mouth. There's a reason for that buyer. But go for,
was basically what the worldwide web was before the worldwide web. And it came out of
University of Minnesota. They were using it for their basically to organize documenting their
campus and various activities. But some bright sparks said, wait a minute, we've written all
this software. We could start charging for it. And as soon as they, they attached the catch register,
there was this thing that was coming out of CERN code, the worldwide web, or at least a web server.
And there were standards coming out of CERN. And nobody was charging for nothing. And you could do
all these fancy tricks with Emily Jews and Watton or or whatever, or at least you could do it
safe as much as you could under Gopher and maybe more. And setting up a server didn't cost you two
cents. So people dropped Gopher like a hot rock and the worldwide web took over.
Yes, and look what I call us. Actually, Gopher is not dead, but the fully legal use of it is
significantly questionable. The only problem is that the university probably has better things
to do these days than to try to enforce a license on there. Now, and now ancient software.
Yeah, I mean, I've used Gopher a little tiny bit. And it just, while I understand that in theory,
it's lighter and simpler even than then Gemini, I just don't like the way it's set up and laid out.
It feels very like, it feels very like a sort of analog to something like plan nine,
because it was a completely sort of distributed system in a way that the web never really was.
And, you know, just like plan nine, that's a cool idea in concept in theory, but in practice,
it's annoying. It's just like, you know, the whole thing seems to be very, yeah.
So, which is why we're not running clear. No, no, no, no. There are so many reasons we're not running
plan nine or other stuff. But, yeah, I mean, I think like with Gopher and with plan nine,
what's nice is somebody went and did that, they made it, and some really good stuff came from it,
and we've been able to take that and put it into other systems. You know, things like UTFA
came from plan nine, and, you know, some of the distributed computing ideas have basically
become the cloud, you know, the cloud is now replacement for that. So, you know, it wasn't a complete
waste, and I'm sure we got some ideas from Gopher that we've implemented elsewhere. Something
like Gemini just feels like, hey, I don't know, I like Gemini in theory, and I quite like it as
a sort of an alternative for purely text-driven things, but yeah, I'm not exactly sure about
it's sort of use in the future. Yeah, it's very odd, but I'm always excited to try these things,
and I maintain it. Actually, I don't know the Gemini universe, but I do writing for my
private enjoyment, and something like Gemini might be a good fit for a mulch with, for
I write in plain text, and I mean, plain asking. And something like Gemini might be great for that,
or for some of the documentation. So, again, I don't know Gemini, so I can't really say,
but it sounds like it could, could be a great option for pure documentation, and, as you say,
text-based work. Yeah. You don't worry about whether you're going to put a lot of images into it,
or a lot of you don't need a molding icon, or any of the fancy stuff that the web has been built
around lately. Yeah, for me, actually, the thing that Gemini excels at is accessibility,
and the reason it excels there is because of separation of concerns, and you're saying about
images and stuff like that, Gemini can handle images. So, you can put an image on your web server,
and on your server, and basically make a link to that image in Gemini, and basically using
mind-type detection, a client, such as Amphora, or Lagrange, and Determine, oh, that is an image.
And the client then decides how it wants to handle that, whether it wants you to basically
download as a file to view, or if it wants to display it in line. But that's for the client
inside the server has nothing to do with it. And you know, that's quite nice, and this also
extends to text. The Gemini text standard is exceedingly simple. It's very similar to Mark
down, but it's basically the only, so each block of text, each paragraph, each line,
the free characters preceding the line determine what that line is, which means you can have
head of one, head of two, head of three, a block, quote, code, block, link, and bullet list.
And that's pretty much it. That's the only formatting you can do. And again, the client determines
how that will be viewed. You can't tell it how that should look. You can't tell a client,
I want this text to be blue, I want this text to be whatever. And this from accessibility point
is great, because if you are somebody with say vision issues, you can set your client up to
always show block quotes, you know, white text on a black background in this size form to
whatever. And every single Gemini site you go to will do that because the text is so simple.
And I actually think that this is something that, you know, the web as a platform could really
learn from because overriding styles on websites is stupidly difficult. And you often and usually
leads to breaking things. And if you talk to like web designers, very rarely have they actually
considered what happens when their design comes into contact with an accessibility requirement
that is not just they need to be able to use keyboard control or they might need to use a screen reader.
You know, from that perspective, I really like how Gemini set up. That simplicity unlocks a lot
of scope for improved, you know, for improved sort of accessibility for different people.
Just to say, it sounds ideal for, well, one, one are going to, as I said, it's to be our
placement for the old cofer, which was for documenting a university's classes and function,
whatever. Documenting it in a way that is accessible to virtually any person with
regardless of their perception, difficult. I'm saying, if you, if you could,
uh, also, if you could force people to write it in Gemini first and then put it on the web.
Yeah. And, um, I know, for example, there are several, um, Gemini to web proxies.
I know one was written by Drew Devolt, who at the time was a big big supporter of Gemini.
And basically it allows you to write your gem log using Gemini and then proxy it through to a
front facing web server. And it converts that into very simple HTML. Because at the end of the
day, all of the stuff that the, um, all of the stuff that the Gemini format is rendering is
something that HTML can render very easily. So that, that, that concept is already out there.
And I think, especially, like you say, for documentation, for bloggers, it's really, you know,
useful. And I also quite like the idea. Again, Gemini is limited, but things like videos and images,
you can link to them and then have the client decide how they want to do. Then to deal with that,
which means if you prefer your client to render those things in line and actually show them as
part of the article, you could choose a client that could do that and then set it to do that.
But if you don't, and you don't actually want to load images or videos or whatever,
they just remain links. And, and for me, that's a much better approach than basically having the
site determine for you. Uh, this is how these things are going to render.
So I got to tell you, um, there's another thing where they completely miss the boat. We're dealing
with an aging population. I mean, I'm, I'm approaching the magic, um, social security ages.
Yeah. Uh, and even when I wasn't, I have one eye that is, I'm nearsighted and I have one eye
that is, it without direction would be legally blind. How many of these websites are built
by people with very sharp eyes on very big screens? And the first thing I have to do when I go to
the site is go up to the zoom and start playing it like a flat machine. Yeah. So I mean,
everything looks wonderfully beautiful, but if you actually just have to, uh,
black text on a gray background, which is popular with some people. Yeah. And, uh,
you know, Gemini, Gemini as a discipline is, it is great if nothing happened. Yeah. I,
uh, you know, uh, I make websites, um, and I purposefully make them as simple as possible,
um, while not sacrificing too much in the way of sort of nice design. So I haven't used, on like,
normal websites. I don't use JavaScript. I tend to just use CSS and HTML. And the idea there is
that, you know, in every case, a client should be able to override what you're doing to make it work
for users of assistive technology or just people who prefer different, you know, color schemes and
that kind of thing. Um, I also have vision troubles. So I sort of, um, sensitive to that kind of thing.
But Gemini, like you say, it just makes it so much simpler because as a sort of a standard,
like normal writer, for example, let's say you're just somebody who writes a blog, um, you can't
do anything to affect the way your website looks, your gemlog looks. You bet the most you can do is
is in, you know, put images, put some maybe some ASCII art, um, which again, the client can ignore
if it wants to, if it, because it comes at a preformat to block, you can say, don't show preformat
to blocks. You know, it's, it's, the client has so much control there, which to me just feels like
the logical way around to do it. The other thing is because of the way that, um, Gemini
kind of works, um, with every single action being a single, uh, request to a server, um, you get a
very, very small footprint and also any advanced actions that you want to take has to be written
server side. So we go back to server side rendering and server side, um, scripting rather than relying
on the client to do all the heavy lifting, which is kind of the way the web has gone now. It's like,
you know, the server gets away with doing very little and instead the client computer has to
get more and more and more powerful to deal with, you know, all of the stuff that the designer wants
to deal with. And I think Gemini, as a protocol, having that very, very clear separation of concerns
of this is what the client has responsible for, which is the rendering of the content,
and the sending of request and dealing with certificates and the server is responsible for
everything else. Um, it's just a really, a very neat and clean clear cut way of doing it,
which I quite appreciate. Well, that in a lot of ways, that's, uh, that's where a whale
comes in too, uh, the guest tops have twisted the pure, the simple x protocol
into something that makes a pretzel look like a straighter. Yeah. Yeah. It's absolutely right.
It's, um, yeah. It's this thing of, uh, that one of the big things that the person sold upon
who was the person who designed the Gemini protocol, uh, one of the things they have, they very
strongly pushed against right from the beginning was expansion of this back, like the spec
should not be expandable in any real way, because as they pointed out, that was kind of what happened
with the web, the web just kept expanding new specs, kept getting added. And we've got to the point
now where, you know, we have this, um, we have this kind of tri-opoli of web browsers. You have
crony and based, you have, um, web kit based, and you have get co-based. And the amount of resource
that would be required for somebody to come in and create a brand new, um, you know, a brand new
web browser from scratch that can actually handle all of the different sort of, uh, specifications
of the web would be enormous. It would be like an absolutely enormous undertaking. And, you know,
if even Microsoft has backed away from doing it, there's a problem with that. And that just comes
from the fact that the web is infinitely expanding in terms of its scope. And the same thing happened
with X, as you said, like X started as a very simple sort of protocol to render, you know, graphics
across networks and has become this ungodly, complicated, extremely powerful hydra of the protocol.
So Gemini has a built-in that the spec can't really expand. It just isn't, you know, expandable
in any meaningful sense. If you wanted to change something or add something to the specification,
it would require so much work and so many different sort of, um, sign-offs from people
who have been instructed to say no, but it just probably would never happen. Um, and it's
that kind of beauty and simplicity thing that I quite like about it. And there isn't even, I mean,
go for it technically simpler, and because it doesn't have to deal with things like TLS certificates.
And there's another new approach called and Gemini, which came out called Spartacus, which is,
very, very, very similar to, uh, is it Spartan Spartacus Spartan, can't remember,
but, um, very similar to Gemini, would be exception that it does not, um, require TLS certificates.
Everything is just plain text and is just transmitted without encryption of any kind,
whereas Gemini is very strongly, um, backed by sort of tofu principle use of TLS certificates.
So, hit your poison that I personally quite like. The idea of using certificates for things,
I think that as an authentication mechanism on the few sites that I used on Gemini,
which use authentication, the TLS certificate solution has been very, uh, elegant.
So, you know, well, I have an, I am planning on using installing or what have you.
So, my stuff is going to be strictly in house. What I do like the idea of
of having some capability of putting in certification locally, uh, but, uh, again, I'm going to have
to learn how to generate my own certificates. So, I'm not planning on, uh,
cranking things enough to get an official certificate. Yeah, and the way the Gemini, you know,
works, like I say, it uses tofu, so trust on first use. You don't need your self-science
certificate is considered to be absolutely fine for a Gemini site. You don't need to go to
something like let's encrypt and have a CA sign off on it. The idea is that the client trusts
the certificate, the first time it connects to the site, and then basically checks against
that every time it reconnects. So, if you change a certificate, then people would see a warning
saying you've changed it, um, but in theory it's just a, uh, a sort of authentication mechanism
in that perspective, but self-science is very much the standard on gem logs, like my gem log just has a
is self-science certificate that I made using Open SSL on the command line, just stuck in it
folder somewhere. This is like, you know, you don't have to get go through the whole, you know,
request to CA's, it requires to certificate from a certificate authority and that sort of thing,
which is far breathable in my opinion, because I, uh, for something as simple as what Gemini
sort of, um, is proposing. I'm sort of of the opinion that it's much easier to trust a server
that hosts some content than it is to put my trust into, uh, certificate authorities who, you know,
let's face it, I don't know. Um, if I don't know if I can trust them or as, you know,
if I've connected to gemmy.dev and their content appears to be their content, then, you know,
that's as far as the trust need go. There's no sensitive information being transmitted.
I shouldn't need to have a certificate authority sign between us that I have to independently
vet, you know, trust. Well, as I said, I'm an old, old internet fan, and I was running into,
I have a number of computers, and I was, I was looking for a protocol to transfer files between
them, and I'd rather the things be how some level of security, which is to say, I don't want
everything plain text like, uh, like old fashioned pure FTP. My solution is, uh, that I use as, uh,
as I say, HQs, and with the S secure copy or more securely S FTP. Yeah. I mean, for transferring,
for transferring files, uh, Gemini is not the, is not the solution, but, um, things like, and I, you know,
I highly recommend if people are interested in Gemini and something a little bit more, uh, advanced
that Gemini can do beyond just, um, you know, posting text articles, which is obviously the
primary use case. Um, I do highly recommend people to check out something called station,
which is station dot martinru.com on Gemini. Um, it's a, like I say, it's a micro blogging site.
It is a sort of a Twitter-like thing, which allows you to post, um, you know, updates, post comments,
like things, and it uses TLS certificates to do all of this to authenticate you. So when you first
sign up, you put in a username, and you provide a TLS certificate to authenticate yourself.
What you can then do is you can set up an additional account password, and then when you go
to another computer and generate a new certificate, you can, uh, basically pass that certificate to
the server and say, I would like to associate this with my account. You put in your username and your
password, and then it associates that certificate to your account. So it's using quite a, it's actually
quite a sort of, um, interesting example of how TLS can be used. TLS certificates can be used on Gemini
to authenticate users across different devices and to, um, you know, you know, and obviously
using TLS to encrypt the data between the client and the server. Um, but well, it reminds me of the
old, uh, KGP. A little bit. Yeah. Um, it's, it's slightly less cumbersome because again, the client
is in control. And if you have a modern day client, like a really, a really good example of a client,
if anybody's interested in trying Gemini, and just want something that will take care of all
this stuff for them, the best one I know of is one called Lagrange, uh, because Lagrange has like a
one-click system for creating certificates for you. Um, and basically it just backs on to OpenFSL
on the, on the, on the client, but, you know, um, you basically just say create me a new certificate.
It does all of that bit for you. So it's a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a lot of the barriers that, you know,
PGP add, um, although I was talking to George and apparently there's a really nice system for using
PGP now called mail the look. So if you're a user of like webmail, um, you know, that's also been
reduced somewhat as a, as a, as a barrier. Yeah, no, no, as I specifically mentioned you because I
don't know much about it. Um, well, I, I learned about it. It moths and, uh, a nice little set of
I ended up installing it. It works pretty much all of my, uh, GMA works with all the webme,
a store them locally as well. But I mean, they're on there and I've sent you stuff sometimes. Yeah.
Yeah. We, we, we, we tested it out and it works perfectly. I think when it comes to that kind of
encryption, the biggest barrier has always been the complexity, um, for the average user. So
the more tools that we can get that, just take down those walls, um, the better frankly.
Um, I'm, I'm the sort of person. I'm still quite old school. I still prefer to do things, you know,
on a command line. They still prefer to do things using, you know, just the GPG tools built in,
stuff like that. But, you know, if I, if I wanted my dad to use encryption on email,
I just send him a link to mail below, just get into that. So, well, what, what, what I,
what I ran into, again, I have an imp had a chance to implement anything of it, is if I
take my old, uh, FTP server and then plug in a SSL certificate, then it has this Gemini sort of
security between, it becomes from FTPS, which makes it like HTTPS. And because I'm not planning on
doing it industrially, as long as I can create that certificate and plug it into my server,
it will provide just enough security for, for the applicant, for, for, um,
for my particular file transfers in house. Yeah. I mean, SSH is, I think, reasonably
secure for most operations in period. Frankly, I mean, there, there's a reason that, you know,
we still use it for things like logging into service, securely logging into things like,
you know, it's pushing commits to get help and that sort of thing. I think it's a, it's a pretty
good. Let's, let's face it. Anything that isn't used in Emma Password is, it's pretty good in my
books. Um, but what, what, what I'm saying is, again, I have an implemented this, this is not
SFTP, this is FTPS, which is FTP over SSL. Yeah. And if I don't have to keep handing out certificates,
I mean, if I don't have to, to keep handing out, uh, I realize that SSHTs are great for
passwordless login. But I'm saying, if I can just put a certificate in and then have the FTP server
handle and client handle, handle securing the transfer, that's just enough security. Yeah, you know,
and I'm, I'm looking at that and I looked at, uh, I, I looked at all of the, I looked at, uh,
SSHFS, et cetera. And I said, for my particular use with it, you know, just around around the house,
I'd like to, I like FTP, but I don't like the plain text version of it, but if, if I have SSL in
the way, it's just like jumping from HTTP to HTTPS. Yeah. Without having friend, and again, I'm using
user certificates. Pack this, I've got a, uh, mumble that we're using right now has the user
certificate user made certificate in after wandering all over the file transfer universe. I ended
up right back at FTP plus SSL. I think just using the SFTP, which is just FTP inside the SSH wrapper,
I think it's more secure and easier to use. That's just my personal opinion. I use it all day
every day at work, um, and most of the secure file transfers we do, uh, the vendors we work with,
especially banks, uh, will support FTP with TLS, but they prefer SFTP with, uh, Kielis on,
Kiel authentication about passwords. Yeah. You don't have to do it for a man like you're using
a graphical tool, but, uh, files that, um, and, uh, at the, uh, key in there, uh, for your connections.
So you can always connect with the graphical tool or command line you can now an interesting,
I don't know if this is current because it was dated six months ago, uh, FTP of SSHFS,
the main tanner is stepped away. So I, I understand that it was at least for a time and orphan.
I don't know if that's current information, but that's what I was in one of my latest, uh,
for a, uh, on YouTube that they were saying that the original main tanner is stepped out.
Yeah, it looks like it's, uh, it's like it's been archived. You've got me.
It's interesting. It is. Um, I use it every day, like, I, like, say, I do use Gemini, uh,
because I have this incredibly slow pink pad, which can really only deal with text based
applications and browsing the web using links is a nightmare because most websites are terrible.
So using, you know, Gemini, which is specifically sets up to be handled by any kind of client
by the graphical text based is vastly superior, um, over the vastly superior way of running the
web and the, the screenshot I just sent you, that's a, there's a person called, um, and they call
them some gemmy dot there, but I don't actually know what their name is. Obviously, it's synonymous,
but, um, they've created a bunch of really cool, um, really cool tools for Gemini. So they've
got a, uh, a search engine called Kennedy, a weather service called Chilewever, uh, a frontend
for Wikipedia on Gemini, um, news waffle, which is the app I sent you, which, which basically allows you
to read news from any source you want to, you can just put a source in and say, find, you know,
if I wanted to get news from the register, I could add it as a, I could say, enter your favorite
news, and put an HTTP S, the register.com, and it would do it, it would do it's level best to go
and make that into a readable format for Gemini. So there's a bunch of really cool stuff being done
on Gemini, um, and it's great for people who are using, um, slower machines, or just like I say,
who want to be able to read something like BBC News without having to encounter the absolute
trash design that BBC News has, um, especially with regards to things such as accessibility.
And I'll say, BBC News is the worst, but it doesn't do its due diligence to make sure it
actually reads well. The, the front screen of BBC News isn't nightmare, um, you know,
if I, I used, uh, and I'm going to say in the early 2000s or computer, um, I used a sneak back
server, or at home, or you kind of theories, but I had when I would browse, they didn't really
catch that. We'll all end up going the way of Richard Storman and having a server,
download the raw HTML for us, and then forwarding it to an email address that we then just read
the HTML in Emacs. That's how it's all going to go, eventually, as the web will become so
unbearable. Hey, I'm mostly using Neo of him at the moment, but yeah, Emacs is also great.
You know, I'm just saying that that's a famous thing is that as the Richard Storman
doesn't browse the web using a web browser, you just send it sends the link to a thing. I
think he sends it. Somebody will send him a link via email, his server will kind of like
rip the HTML out and he will then just read the HTML code, because he's a very sad man with
a lot of time. Yeah, I'm drinking coffee right, mugmeteers up. Yeah, speaking of Emacs,
actually, since I'm back in the UK temporarily, I have access to my GNU Emacs manual,
Emacs 26.1, this editor, no, the editor, it's built into the editor. There's no reason to have
the book, necessarily I bought it. Back at there was a conference in Bristol in the United Kingdom
called The Free Node Live and the FSF were there, and this was back when I was like an FSF,
a associate, like a sort of associate member, and I purchased the book for a stupid amount of
money just to support them. And this was just before the whole thing with Storman went down.
Yeah, 558 pages to explain how the text editor works. Yeah. So, so one of the arcamps you missed.
Oh, shut up. But one of the, all of them, I've never been to one. All of them, all of them. But I've
only been there with the key and Luke and I'll throw him on. Oh, Riley's was there. This is
I bought a, I bought this just because it was there in this late reading, this Linux shell handbook.
And he goes, I don't know why the heck you're buying that. You could just pull up the man command.
Yeah. Yeah. Well, I will say this hunting nice about having a book and there's something
in, in my opinion, fairly unpleasant about reading man pages. I don't know what it is, particularly
about man pages. I don't like the way G-Rough edit, like, formats things. I think it's
ugly and difficult to work out. And also, I do feel that most people who write software are
very bad at writing man pages or documentation in general. But that's because I'm a technical
writer. And I need to convince people that my job is worthwhile. We want, we want to get into
because this is right, can you? But yeah, we won't get into it.
Oh, it's validating your job. So it's to try to use the software without your documentation.
Yeah, yeah. It's pretty, it, when you find a piece of software that someone's documented really well,
it's an absolute joy, honestly. Like, there's nothing better than, like, being able to run a
sort of, you know, help commander or a man command that actually getting the information you want
directly at your fingertips. That's, that's really useful. I think the biggest thing for me
that I'm lacking with command line tools is I want to see more specific examples of uses.
It's fine. It's all fine and good telling me, like, you know, what do all of the flags do?
But actually, most of the time, I have a specific use case, which I think is very common. And I'm
just like, I just want you to show me, you know, what would I type in to get that result?
And then you can explain after that, what do all of the flags do? You know, Open SSL actually is a
really good, really good example of this. If I just want to generate a very basic sort of, you know,
keep here for a, for a sort of, a web server. I just want there to be an example of that. And every
website you go to that, you know, does instructions just gives you the example first and then told you,
and like the man page could do that. You know, there's nothing to say that you couldn't do that in the
man page, but, you know, that's just me and it's me being a, you know, fairly new, be personally as opposed.
You are. It's true. I don't know why you trust me with our infrastructure.
I mean, I've been doing it for many years now, and unfortunately, I don't know what's
you might fit in our own higher infrastructure. But I must object the EMAX manual does not tell you
how EMAX works. It does do how to use it. Sorry. That's true, because there is no set way that EMAX
works. Actually, I have a book here and if I take a few minutes, I may be able to dig it out of
my best stack of books here about how to build it. It is also now degenerated to something you
can get in PDFs online, but I think it has money for it. It goes through all of the things
from keyboards, from different memory models, excruciating details. Now, it does not tell you how
to write any MAX in which, but it tells you why you would use this to do it.
Did you really like parentheses? Well, as an introductory project, I was tasked
in college with writing Tico in Pascal, and our instructor knew what she was doing, which was
deadly. It was deadly because the instructor would hand out, this is today's project,
this little puzzle piece, and we're trying to learn the language and programming the structure,
and deal with her cryptic descriptions of what we were trying to do, and we were trying to do it
on a cray computer, which is to say we did not have any of the nice features of your average
PC, Portland, Pascal. We weren't lucky if we had a line out of here. I think a lot of stuff was
was if you need to correct it, delete and write over. The successful people on that project
use more of a Xerox method than an IBM. Right. Because when the teacher is
the teacher measures ahead of you, if you're going to pass the final project, you find somebody
who's project works, and then you go in and edit variable name. Yes, as they say, good artists
imitate great artists steal seemingly busy watching videos. I'm busy celebrating all of the
name with the families. I remember there was that meme of two programmers talking to each other. One
of them says, bro, I stole your code, and the other one says, bro, it wasn't my code. It's basically
like my very limited experience as a professional programmer, which literally lasted a few months,
I hated working as a programmer. I mostly just stole code off of other people, and then when I
asked them to explain it, they would be like, I don't know, I saw it from someone else. It's
so true. I don't know if anyone's written a line of code since the early 90s. I think that's
when we start as a species producing new code. It'll make some noise. Yeah, I've got to make some
coffee. Before you go, I have a use that group for those of you who are suffering from means
system maintenance. I think I'll be able to use that user in technical found on Joe. Well,
it's not really used to anybody. I mean, it is use that, but I'm getting it off of Google Group.
So, I may be considered not necessarily co-chirp. Alt's, this admin recover it. It is a
assistant men and recovery getting over the trauma of system in this place. It's a moderated group.
If you remember, if you remember a classic
assistant men posting this operator from hell, you know, I would say we'll solve all of your
problems with that file. Just type RF, flash, you know, RF, flash, star, dot star. Yeah, I don't know
if anybody reads in the register series, a comedy series called BFF. I highly, highly recommend
if you are somebody who worked in systems that like systems administration or tech support. It's a
very cathartic comedy series about, you know, because this is a broad casting. I won't mention
what it stands for, but it's something operator from hell, you can work out the rest. But it's just a
very cathartic one because it's always about this operator and his pimple faced you for assistant
who abuse their stupid staff who keep asking them for stupid things on computers. It's very funny.
I'll send you a good example of it. Right, I'm going to get some more coffee, but I shall be back.
I think I'm going to do the same. Greetings to you, man. And six more tokyos, y'all.
Good time, Dilly. Yes, happy new year.
Well, it's rubbishy instant coffee, but it's coffee nonetheless.
Well, I'm drinking water at the moment for as long as possible, that I have a problem with
dehydration, but I, but I have Mountain Dew and Coca-Cola in reserve for later in the mentioned.
Okay. And what is it sort of morning for you for the moment?
Delight, it's 10 o'clock because I've been up most of the night, you know, things give it a little
fuzzy. Yeah. Well, I mean, by different definitions give it a little fuzzy.
Yeah. By my last job, I was doing security in a little gatehouse midnight day,
officially, although as the company was losing the contractor, throwing it away, actually.
We started having those 64 hour weeks where who cares what time it is on back the work.
Also, I was taking a lot of coconut caffeine.
Now, the black colored coat, not the white colored coat. We were taking up money to buy the white
color stuff. Yeah. But when you're looking at the same stretch of empty, dark,
road, let's see. Well, the last time I looked at that 15 minutes ago or two hours,
really doesn't make that much difference. The reason I say our company was throwing it away
was that we were paid a magnificent 7 or 7, 50 an hour. And the company was bought my former
employer. We were the highest paid of their of the crop. And they went to the condos. We were
providing security for the condo guys. Would say, could you do X, Y, or Z? And they would say,
sorry, no, thank you. We'll see you next month. And after a while, we condo association decided
they could have somebody else telling them. But then again, our condo gate was a stop sign in
the speed bump. So it's not exactly. Of course, yet when I was there, my final stretch.
We were only doing patrols on weekends. We had one young lady whose wife, whose mother was
as she was a single mother and her daughter was, shall we say, popular. And she had a double
lit Blair condo. It had the front door on one level. And emergency exits to the bedroom level
upstairs. Now for one thing, most of the week we were supposed to secure the her her virtue
at about a hundred yards without a rifle. And also this condo had it on one side of the double
driveway was an area that was not under our security protection. So people could
say that we're visiting over there, and we couldn't stop. This place wasn't well-fenced.
Well, when this young lady's 18th birthday came around, the security team celebrated it
almost as much as she could. Because you could go to the front door and the parties of interest could
be leaving out over your head at the floor you couldn't see. We were good, but seemed to
it was the mat floor, it was beyond our compliment. Although it was the kind of place where a lot
of things were more features than an effective. You had a fence around the pool, good. It was
too full of time, which meant that it could stop anyone trying to rescue somebody, but probably
wouldn't stop anybody trying to get in. I did have an interesting conversation with someone
in a state police uniform and a car marked state police. The gentleman said that may I
check on my girlfriend, and I did a bit of who's on purpose. And sure, tell me who it is, and I'll
give them a call, and you can go up and have coffee with them. Or you can tell me what a
visual police business you have with that person, and I'll lock up my little gatehouse, and I'll
escort you up there, and everybody will have fun. What I can't do is let a random police person
drive around our parking lot, looking for interesting positions numbers or whatever. That's what
I'm not supposed to do. So you can take one from column A or one from column B, but column C is
locked up. Well, especially since it was rumors that some people on our condo might be selling
pharmaceuticals, not exactly FDA approved, and it was also known that one of our people tended
to help people with their, well, let's say this person was in competition with the state
lottery among others. In fact, one day we had a jogger come in inquiring about something random,
while this gentleman had a guest and a trail car enter the property. The jogger was
being my attention while this was happening, so it's pure speculation that the visitors were
ventrists in the government, and the jogger was a decoy. I didn't know that, but it was a,
we didn't have many joggeres come into the property. Yeah, so it's self-alarm bell. As for Richard said,
you know, you may suspect the milk, you can question whether or not the milk's been ordered,
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